Curse

Xenufa · Aug 12, 2005, 05:05 PM // 17:05

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kabale

Your degree taught you this?

...

Haha! Sorry, did this before the coffee kicked in, i fixed it now... but anyways, my point was that there were MUCH better solutions than what ANET did.

Mugon M. Musashi · Aug 12, 2005, 05:07 PM // 17:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by ifuwerepbandj

Lets think about this for a second....We were all asking for the traders to become more viable. Anet did that. All of you people who say the idea to reset prices was the dumbest thing they could have done, think about what you would have done.

hum, I don't know... let's see... maybe, it's just a stupid idea but, set the traders to sell at an average price instead of the lowest price at the start ?

MSecorsky · Aug 12, 2005, 05:11 PM // 17:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mugon M. Musashi

hum, I don't know... let's see... maybe, it's just a stupid idea but, set the traders to sell at an average price instead of the lowest price at the start ?

Lowest prices are known. Average prices probably required all new batch of coding, algorithms, etc.

Silmor · Aug 12, 2005, 05:13 PM // 17:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Lowest prices are known. Average prices probably required all new batch of coding, algorithms, etc.

Or pesky things like rudimentary trade logs, a shard variable snapshot before an update, you know, nothing a serious gaming company would care about.

This is no excuse.

DiAnna · Aug 12, 2005, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Well, I finally got to sell my dye without spending two hours shuffling around storage, yelling "WTS..." every five minutes. I sold it to the trader. Yep. Got decent prices all around.

Now if the rune trader would take a hint from the dye trader, and give decent, flexible prices for runes so those of us who are sick of spending hours trying to get 200g for a rune that the trader sells for 1k despite offering to buy for only 25g, then I suspect the economy would be well on the way to recovery. (I had no runes to sell yesterday, so do not know if the rune trader's buy prices have emulated the dye trader... I sincerely hope that they have.)

IF... and it's a big if... Anet can find a way around the players who have crashed the sup rune market by hoarding the entire available stock. As long as the only sup vigor runes (or any other sought-after items) are controlled by players who can hoard the entire supply, then set the moon and six stars as a price, the game's economy will remain precarious and unhealthy, IMHO.

ANet's recourse at this point is to flood the NPC traders with near endless supplies of these currently-hoarded, manipulated items until any player can purchase them, and players begin selling their excess back to the traders rather than hawk them to each other for inflated prices. It makes the hoarded supplies relatively worthless, of course... but it helps repair the damage the hoarders have caused in the first place.

Algren Cole · Aug 12, 2005, 05:15 PM // 17:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by ifuwerepbandj

Lets think about this for a second....We were all asking for the traders to become more viable. Anet did that. All of you people who say the idea to reset prices was the dumbest thing they could have done, think about what you would have done. Anet is not perfect. While I agree that it would have been better to average all of the realm's prices....would you have forseen such a problem with hoarders? If you say yes please remember a little basic psychology lesson in something called "hindsight bias". The update is a great one that will eventually fix the economy. The fact that it generated billions of gp is a drawback, but I think Anet is going to take care of us. All of you people who are quitting over this need to take a chill pill because you have some serious patience problems. Wait a week and watch the prices stabilize.

or they could have taken an average mean price for each rune/material for all countries and formulated the difference out into an algorithm that would have stabalized the economy over the course of a week or two. Each rune would drop in sale price by a few gp every hour and gain a buy back price of a few gp every hour until the sale price and the buy back price for each rune had hit the average mean at which point they would stop and calculate the number of runes purchased versus the number of runes bought from players to get a basic(yes admittedly very basic) idea of how many runes were in the virtual world. Then they could have kicked the supply/demand system back in without ever disrupting the flow of the economy....

that's how I would of done it atleast....

Xonic · Aug 12, 2005, 05:16 PM // 17:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by ifuwerepbandj

All of you people who are quitting over this need to take a chill pill because you have some serious patience problems. Wait a week and watch the prices stabilize.

I say let them quit

MSecorsky · Aug 12, 2005, 05:18 PM // 17:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silmor

Or pesky things like rudimentary trade logs, a shard variable snapshot before an update, you know, nothing a serious gaming company would care about.

This is no excuse.

So people want a fix and want it yesterday. ANet gives them the fix. People complain because ANet didn't take a few more weeks researching algorithms and the like, or didn't release the game a few months later while they built a completely hidden price tracking system.

Sheesh. It was a temporary hiccup. Get over it.

Xonic · Aug 12, 2005, 05:19 PM // 17:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Algren Cole

or they could have taken an average mean price for each rune/material for all countries and formulated the difference out into an algorithm that would have stabalized the economy over the course of a week or two. Each rune would drop in sale price by a few gp every hour and gain a buy back price of a few gp every hour until the sale price and the buy back price for each rune had hit the average mean at which point they would stop and calculate the number of runes purchased versus the number of runes bought from players to get a basic(yes admittedly very basic) idea of how many runes were in the virtual world. Then they could have kicked the supply/demand system back in without ever disrupting the flow of the economy....

that's how I would of done it atleast....

now, just how important are gold, and black colored armor in GW that they have to spend days of the development time to implenment such a complexed change-over?

If it's up to me I would say screw all the whiners and let them quit. but then again, I won't be a sucessfule game developer, ever, with that mind set.

Algren Cole · Aug 12, 2005, 05:21 PM // 17:21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Xonic

now, just how important are gold, and black colored armor in GW that they have to spend days of the development time to implenment such a complexed change-over?

If it's up to me I would say screw all the whiners and let them quit. but then again, I won't be a sucessfule game developer, ever, with that mind set.

any programmer worth a damn could code, test and implement something as simple as that in under 20 hours.....if I was a developer 20 hours to save my pride and joy would be well worth it.....but then again I gave up developing video games some years ago.

EDIT: No it's not only people that weren't online. I was at the trader purchasing a superior protection rune for 40 plat when I went to storage (trader window still up) to get the money. I got the money and clicked request quote and noticed that superior protection runes were now going for 300 gold....So I purchased 40 something of them. It's not about getting rich or being bitter because we weren't there for it....it's about ArenaNET making a GIANT mistake....and some of us realizing what the reprocutions are going to be.

Ashraven · Aug 12, 2005, 05:25 PM // 17:25

Quote:

If ANet is indeed restocking the traders slowly, then thats a good sign, because people who continue to horde will end up losing out greatly. If they do sell, then it will just bring down prices to the equilibrium faster (and the horders would actually save their stock from devaluing too much). I think this is only part of the solution though. If they want to fix up the economy more, they need to get rid of gold. Too much gold was generated when people were farming for ecto in the previous patches. They probably make 30k gold before 1 ecto would drop. They should make some NPC that crafts ecto for 10k gold, and make ecto drops rarer. That way gold will be drained from the economy very quickly. FoW armor isn't a gold sink because in the process of obtaining the ecto and shards, massive amounts of gold is generated (much more than the 15k per armor piece). Gold just changes hands from people who want the FoW armor to people who don't want it but have ecto to sell. If Ecto prices are set and an unlimited supply can be brought, then about 2 million gold would be drained per Fissure set.

I agree. Unless traders restock at a reasonable rate, Anet has only produced a temporary fix and the economy will it NOT even out (to a significant level) over time. What has also happened is that Anet has severely downgraded the value of rare items- not in a monetary sense, but from strictly a RGP point of view.

Lets think back to when Anet was creating this game. You can image one of the developers say "Hey, why don't we make special runes that will increase one's abilities/stats. Hey, that's a good idea, but we'll make some powerful ones that will be harder to find. Yeah, this should make role-playing (PVE) much more exciting.

Now look at what's happened. There is no point in trying to find rare items, especially superior runes and black dyes. What's the point now? Only to make money. IMO, this is a hard blow to the PvE community. So, in the end, the implementation of traders and the "new economy" is that they've totally negated the initial reasons for creating gold weapons, superior runes, black dyes, etc. in the first place. You might as well just totally take out the rune system and everyone will be back on an even playing field. Isn't that what you wanted Anet? An even playing field? Balanced combat?

Let me recap. So now all I have to do to get something is go to a trader and buy it! Wow, that's so fun and exciting. I love it! Fun, Fun, Fun!!! Let see, what else can Anet do to make it even better. Lets get gold weapon traders and make them replenish their supplies every two weeks. Yeah, more FUN!!!!

Normally, I don't rant and whine and I may be exaggerating, but I think in this case, Anet has reacted way to quickly to try and resolve issues, but only to create new ones. I commend them for listening to the community and I have no doubt that they are trying their best, but there was some serious lack of vision with the "significant" updates.

-Ashraven

BrandonIT · Aug 12, 2005, 05:30 PM // 17:30

No, the point of Runes was to give you a boost in one stat at a health deficit.

Guild Wars has always been about give/take. Nothing in the game gives a sizeable reward without a drawback usually.

I think Superior Runes should cost you 100 health not 75, to put them more on par with Major/Minor rune costs.

MSecorsky · Aug 12, 2005, 05:33 PM // 17:33

Quote:

Originally Posted by BrandonIT

I think Superior Runes should cost you 100 health not 75, to put them more on par with Major/Minor rune costs.

Beware the 5 HP build monks!

cunninghambone · Aug 12, 2005, 05:37 PM // 17:37

I think the people who are really pissed about it are the ones who weren't online when it happened. Has anyone thought that maybe anet did it as a gift to people. I've never been extremely rich in game, but due to the price drop, now I'm friggin' set! Honestly, would you rather have black dye costing 34k? I think it's cool what they've done, but I'd probably be pissed if I missed out on all the fun. The only downside is it seems like materials have been capped kinda low, which was my main source of income, but since I bought 30 ectos at 1k each and resold them for 7 times as much, I'll be ok.

kareel · Aug 12, 2005, 05:39 PM // 17:39

Because of all the new rich people, the game is dead

giroml · Aug 12, 2005, 05:39 PM // 17:39

This update does something great for the casual player (me). It allows me to get a decent sell price to the merchant. I don't want to deal with player traders and this allows me to completely ignore them now and still make decent money from the drops I don't want. Do I care if someone else gets rich, no I do not. More power to them, I just want to be able to get a fair market value for my items from the NPC merchant and now I do.

kareel · Aug 12, 2005, 05:41 PM // 17:41

No it doesn't Gir. There are bots camping the various merchants and buying out stock as soon as it comes in.

You'll never be able to get what you want any more, and as such, you'll soon become just as bored with the game as the rest of us.

MSecorsky · Aug 12, 2005, 05:41 PM // 17:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by kareel

Because of all the new rich people, the game is dead

Why? If everything is reasonably priced, wealth is irrelevant. If you're a regular Joe and I'm a millionaire and we both pay five bucks for a cheeseburger, we're both still full and the rest of my money had no effect on the cheeseburger.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kareel

No it doesn't Gir. There are bots camping the various merchants and buying out stock as soon as it comes in.

Keep the resupply going, soon the bots will be full of stuff they can't unload and everyone else will buy what they need from the merchants.

kareel · Aug 12, 2005, 05:43 PM // 17:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Why? If everything is reasonably priced, wealth is irrelevant. If you're a regular Joe and I'm a millionaire and we both pay five bucks for a cheeseburger, we're both still full and the rest of my money had no effect on the cheeseburger.

That, my friend, was the single most intelligent comment I've yet seen in this thread.

Algren Cole · Aug 12, 2005, 05:44 PM // 17:44

Quote:

Originally Posted by MSecorsky

Why? If everything is reasonably priced, wealth is irrelevant. If you're a regular Joe and I'm a millionaire and we both pay five bucks for a cheeseburger, we're both still full and the rest of my money had no effect on the cheeseburger.

and what is regular Joe supposed to do for food when you buy every cheeseburger available leaving the Supermarket out of stock?

he's gonna pay 10 bucks for the same cheeseburger you bougth for 5 bucks...cuz the man's gotta eat.